Comments on: Another GOPocalypse http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/ n. the principle of good order<br /><br /> "Observe the strange inversion of all order and sense! Dignity debased; how vilely is the function of a consul prostituted!" ~The Craftsman Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:39:05 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.3 hourly 1 By: John http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/comment-page-1/#comment-10807 John Sun, 18 May 2008 02:52:04 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/#comment-10807 There is a nice - by my lights, anyway - <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/18/washington/18cong.html" rel="nofollow">piece</a> in tomorrow's <i>Times</i> about what the rise of the conservative Democrats means for the party. It's worth a look: <blockquote> This intramural ideological divide is not a new problem for Congressional Democrats. Back in the days before the 1994 Republican revolution, Congressional Democrats were always split between the traditional liberal big-city wing of the party and Southern boll weevil Democrats who never met a military project they didn’t like or a social reform initiative they did. But Democrats were able to hold power for four decades because of their imposing majorities in Congress, often outnumbering Republicans by 100 or more. That cushion meant party leaders could allow dozens of Democrats to take a walk on contentious bills, protecting their voting records while the majority prevailed regardless. Today, even with this month’s Democratic gains, the partisan spread is 236 to 199, a growing but still relatively small margin for disagreement. But Democrats figure if they can keep winning, they can enlarge their majority to a point where it does not matter if lawmakers on the ideological edges stray.</blockquote> The question will be whether those Democrats who tend rightward on certain issues will be able to bring themselves to align with the conservative members of the Republican coalition and make a real difference. Otherwise the occasional dissenters are just going to be voices crying out in the wilderness. But I suppose that's better than nothing - someone needs to prepare the way, and all that. There is a nice – by my lights, anyway – piece in tomorrow’s Times about what the rise of the conservative Democrats means for the party. It’s worth a look:

This intramural ideological divide is not a new problem for Congressional Democrats. Back in the days before the 1994 Republican revolution, Congressional Democrats were always split between the traditional liberal big-city wing of the party and Southern boll weevil Democrats who never met a military project they didn’t like or a social reform initiative they did.

But Democrats were able to hold power for four decades because of their imposing majorities in Congress, often outnumbering Republicans by 100 or more. That cushion meant party leaders could allow dozens of Democrats to take a walk on contentious bills, protecting their voting records while the majority prevailed regardless.

Today, even with this month’s Democratic gains, the partisan spread is 236 to 199, a growing but still relatively small margin for disagreement.

But Democrats figure if they can keep winning, they can enlarge their majority to a point where it does not matter if lawmakers on the ideological edges stray.

The question will be whether those Democrats who tend rightward on certain issues will be able to bring themselves to align with the conservative members of the Republican coalition and make a real difference. Otherwise the occasional dissenters are just going to be voices crying out in the wilderness. But I suppose that’s better than nothing – someone needs to prepare the way, and all that.

]]> By: Daniel Larison http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/comment-page-1/#comment-10774 Daniel Larison Sat, 17 May 2008 03:48:12 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/#comment-10774 I would not pretend this. GOP clones would be undesirable, so long as the GOP continues to go down the wrong path. Clearly, they were successful because they co-opted social conservative positions and maintained the rest of their Democratic positions. From my perspective, two out of four of those positions mark an improvement over what the Republicans are offering. On the others, I don't agree with them, but to be right on the war and trade and wrong on pensions and entitlements seems like the start of a good alternative. I would not pretend this. GOP clones would be undesirable, so long as the GOP continues to go down the wrong path. Clearly, they were successful because they co-opted social conservative positions and maintained the rest of their Democratic positions. From my perspective, two out of four of those positions mark an improvement over what the Republicans are offering. On the others, I don’t agree with them, but to be right on the war and trade and wrong on pensions and entitlements seems like the start of a good alternative.

]]> By: markroge http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/comment-page-1/#comment-10771 markroge Sat, 17 May 2008 01:56:16 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/#comment-10771 Let's not pretend that Childers or Cazayoux are nothing more than GOP clones. It may make GOP strategists feel good to think that, but it's not true. Childers and Cazayoux oppose the war in Iraq, they oppose Social Security privatization, oppose "free-trade" agreements, and favor expanding SCHIP. This doesn't sound like the Republican platform to me. Let’s not pretend that Childers or Cazayoux are nothing more than GOP clones. It may make GOP strategists feel good to think that, but it’s not true. Childers and Cazayoux oppose the war in Iraq, they oppose Social Security privatization, oppose “free-trade” agreements, and favor expanding SCHIP. This doesn’t sound like the Republican platform to me.

]]> By: John http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/comment-page-1/#comment-10766 John Fri, 16 May 2008 18:47:17 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/16/another-gopocalypse/#comment-10766 It might just be that old habits die hard, but I continue to put more faith in the possibility of a reformed GOP than the rise of the conservative Democrats. (There's <i>got</i> to be a reason why Ron Paul hasn't just jumped ship!) I do think, though, that Republicans will always govern - or rather, keep Democrats from governing - most effectively when they're in the position of the embattled and embittered minority; in other circumstances, the allure of power just becomes too great to stand. The greatest problem with all of this, of course, is that the militarism - which is the greatest threat of all to limited and decentralized government - seems unlikely to go away any time soon. Unpopular as the current misadventure may be among the nation as a whole, the GOP knows that they can still whip a sizable portion of the country into a veritable frenzy by bashing our "enemies" and pledging to flex their muscles - and if that's the coalition that's going to keep them present on the national scene, then so be it. It's hard to imagine the party leadership telling the Lovers of Foreign Wars to shove off, though I suspect that if they did, then a good number of those people would change their tune and fall back into line pretty quickly. Sigh. Ultimately, as you've said many times over, conservatives need to be focusing their attention on empowering and revitalizing local governments and institutions, rather than reforming the national ones - a thousand points of light, and all that. Washington be damned, I'm going in for urban gardening. It might just be that old habits die hard, but I continue to put more faith in the possibility of a reformed GOP than the rise of the conservative Democrats. (There’s got to be a reason why Ron Paul hasn’t just jumped ship!) I do think, though, that Republicans will always govern – or rather, keep Democrats from governing – most effectively when they’re in the position of the embattled and embittered minority; in other circumstances, the allure of power just becomes too great to stand.

The greatest problem with all of this, of course, is that the militarism – which is the greatest threat of all to limited and decentralized government – seems unlikely to go away any time soon. Unpopular as the current misadventure may be among the nation as a whole, the GOP knows that they can still whip a sizable portion of the country into a veritable frenzy by bashing our “enemies” and pledging to flex their muscles – and if that’s the coalition that’s going to keep them present on the national scene, then so be it. It’s hard to imagine the party leadership telling the Lovers of Foreign Wars to shove off, though I suspect that if they did, then a good number of those people would change their tune and fall back into line pretty quickly.

Sigh. Ultimately, as you’ve said many times over, conservatives need to be focusing their attention on empowering and revitalizing local governments and institutions, rather than reforming the national ones – a thousand points of light, and all that. Washington be damned, I’m going in for urban gardening.

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