Comments on: Anachoresis http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/ n. the principle of good order<br /><br /> "Observe the strange inversion of all order and sense! Dignity debased; how vilely is the function of a consul prostituted!" ~The Craftsman Sat, 21 Nov 2009 23:02:13 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.3 hourly 1 By: Benny One Six http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-11013 Benny One Six Fri, 23 May 2008 23:26:18 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-11013 The point I was trying to make, is that politics is an unconservative activity. Politics is about the near term and the use of government to effect change. Thus, it seems to me that to the extent a person values politics he is not a conservative. Conversely, to the extent a person values the things extra-governmental and rejects politics, the more conservative he is... Of course, the above could just be my anti-pathy to government talking... The point I was trying to make, is that politics is an unconservative activity. Politics is about the near term and the use of government to effect change. Thus, it seems to me that to the extent a person values politics he is not a conservative. Conversely, to the extent a person values the things extra-governmental and rejects politics, the more conservative he is…

Of course, the above could just be my anti-pathy to government talking…

]]> By: Magnus http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-11011 Magnus Fri, 23 May 2008 23:14:37 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-11011 Benny One Six, You seem to have a pretty idiosyncratic view of what conservatism is. What is a 'conservative' if Burke wasn't one? Benny One Six, You seem to have a pretty idiosyncratic view of what conservatism is. What is a ‘conservative’ if Burke wasn’t one?

]]> By: Benny One Six http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10988 Benny One Six Fri, 23 May 2008 19:07:44 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10988 Well, this isn't going to surprise you, but I think Burke is problematic and didn't lead a quintessentially conservative life... I'm not saying one should live a purely conservative life, or that one should be conservative even, but Burke's engagement with the political issues of his day seems an admission that he wasn't a thoroughgoing conservative... Well, this isn’t going to surprise you, but I think Burke is problematic and didn’t lead a quintessentially conservative life…

I’m not saying one should live a purely conservative life, or that one should be conservative even, but Burke’s engagement with the political issues of his day seems an admission that he wasn’t a thoroughgoing conservative…

]]> By: Adam01 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10968 Adam01 Fri, 23 May 2008 12:31:05 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10968 "Isn’t engaging in politics (especially democratic politics) an admission that one is not conservative…" I'm not sure how accurate that statement is, or if it is accurate, it is used in too sweeping a manner. Burke, certainly, engaged in the trenches of the national politics of his day. Perhaps it is more accurate to describe the conservative view of politics as important, but far from the most important of human activities, and to regard even "conservative" politics with a healthy skepticism. “Isn’t engaging in politics (especially democratic politics) an admission that one is not conservative…”

I’m not sure how accurate that statement is, or if it is accurate, it is used in too sweeping a manner. Burke, certainly, engaged in the trenches of the national politics of his day. Perhaps it is more accurate to describe the conservative view of politics as important, but far from the most important of human activities, and to regard even “conservative” politics with a healthy skepticism.

]]> By: Benny One Six http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10953 Benny One Six Thu, 22 May 2008 23:53:32 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10953 Isn't conservative the wrong word here? Aren't you all talking about the progressive Right as opposed to conservatives (who can be either Right or Left)? Isn't engaging in politics (especially democratic politics) an admission that one is not conservative... Rightist progressives can engage in politics and might be invigorated by a period of exile from power, but don't conservatives live in the wilderness? Isn’t conservative the wrong word here?

Aren’t you all talking about the progressive Right as opposed to conservatives (who can be either Right or Left)?

Isn’t engaging in politics (especially democratic politics) an admission that one is not conservative…

Rightist progressives can engage in politics and might be invigorated by a period of exile from power, but don’t conservatives live in the wilderness?

]]> By: Daniel Larison http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10943 Daniel Larison Thu, 22 May 2008 21:14:40 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10943 I wouldn't say that his comment was silly, but I find the attitude it betrays deeply misguided. Social Security reform is actually a perfect example of how too much "engagement" can blunt important and necessary developments in thinking about policy. Because it is deemed too politically risky in the near term, the idea withers on the vine for another decade instead of being cultivated and fleshed out in debate. Pretty clearly, the "next big things," to borrow McArdle's phrase, are plans for entitlement reform and the development of more responsive, decentralised government. The latter is the one place where the Cameroons are actually onto something that might be applicable over here. Until entitlements are in order or significantly reduced, all talk of health care reform is ludicrous because there will be no fiscally sane way to do it. Also, the "kooky" ideological factor seems to increase the longer the GOP is in power. Being too close to power and lacking in accountability limit one's awareness of policy failures and makes it less likely that one will adjust to changing circumstances. After eight years of "engaging" with the world, both the GOP and conservatives have very little in the way of "useful" ideas to talk about. Being lean and hungry in the opposition can make your arguments sharper and make you aware of things you missed during the comfy years in government. One of the other things that has allowed intellectual torpor and laziness to set in is the lack of a credible opposition that seriously threatened control of policy; now that the Democrats are sort of getting their act together, and seem likely to stomp a mudhole in the House GOP, this will provide more incentive to engage in *more* thinking that addresses the world as it exists rather than recycling talking points. People need competition in order to excel and do their best, and for many years the right lacked vigorous competition. Far from being a disengagement, what McArdle is talking about is the equivalent of rebuilding a franchise after a particularly horrible season. It is McArdle who is responding to changing circumstances here, while Stuttaford appears to be encouraging complacency. I wouldn’t say that his comment was silly, but I find the attitude it betrays deeply misguided. Social Security reform is actually a perfect example of how too much “engagement” can blunt important and necessary developments in thinking about policy. Because it is deemed too politically risky in the near term, the idea withers on the vine for another decade instead of being cultivated and fleshed out in debate. Pretty clearly, the “next big things,” to borrow McArdle’s phrase, are plans for entitlement reform and the development of more responsive, decentralised government. The latter is the one place where the Cameroons are actually onto something that might be applicable over here. Until entitlements are in order or significantly reduced, all talk of health care reform is ludicrous because there will be no fiscally sane way to do it.

Also, the “kooky” ideological factor seems to increase the longer the GOP is in power. Being too close to power and lacking in accountability limit one’s awareness of policy failures and makes it less likely that one will adjust to changing circumstances. After eight years of “engaging” with the world, both the GOP and conservatives have very little in the way of “useful” ideas to talk about. Being lean and hungry in the opposition can make your arguments sharper and make you aware of things you missed during the comfy years in government.

One of the other things that has allowed intellectual torpor and laziness to set in is the lack of a credible opposition that seriously threatened control of policy; now that the Democrats are sort of getting their act together, and seem likely to stomp a mudhole in the House GOP, this will provide more incentive to engage in *more* thinking that addresses the world as it exists rather than recycling talking points. People need competition in order to excel and do their best, and for many years the right lacked vigorous competition. Far from being a disengagement, what McArdle is talking about is the equivalent of rebuilding a franchise after a particularly horrible season. It is McArdle who is responding to changing circumstances here, while Stuttaford appears to be encouraging complacency.

]]> By: chrisgbr http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10942 chrisgbr Thu, 22 May 2008 20:46:00 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10942 At the core of conservatism is an embrace of trial and error -- a desire for knowledge from experience to temper abstract rationalist speculation. If your ideas (and theorized political strategies, with their inherent trade-offs in priorities) are formed in exile for ages without being tested in practice and having to adjust them in response to circumstances, they're likely to become far more kooky. Think of it this way -- are conservatives more likely to try to think that privatizing social security is a top priority now that they've tried, or are they now more likely to turn themselves to more fruitful thoughts and more valued policy priorities? Stuttaford's regularly said silly things that I've disagreed with. This isn't one of them. At the core of conservatism is an embrace of trial and error — a desire for knowledge from experience to temper abstract rationalist speculation. If your ideas (and theorized political strategies, with their inherent trade-offs in priorities) are formed in exile for ages without being tested in practice and having to adjust them in response to circumstances, they’re likely to become far more kooky.

Think of it this way — are conservatives more likely to try to think that privatizing social security is a top priority now that they’ve tried, or are they now more likely to turn themselves to more fruitful thoughts and more valued policy priorities?

Stuttaford’s regularly said silly things that I’ve disagreed with. This isn’t one of them.

]]> By: Daniel Larison http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10941 Daniel Larison Thu, 22 May 2008 20:11:59 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10941 If that is what he meant, he stated it pretty badly. Any political idea that can be put into practice has to take account of trade-offs and political realities. The sort of short-term, "what ideas do we have to keep from losing more House seats this year?" thinking exemplified by Gingrich's to-do list is being driven by events and is entirely reactive. If you are interested in having your side drive the debate on major policy questions, you need to take the initiative and be willing to look beyond the next midterm or general election to imagine a compelling vision and agenda. Always looking to the next election, staying firmly inside "the arena" at all times, is the path to intellectual and political exhaustion. If that is what he meant, he stated it pretty badly. Any political idea that can be put into practice has to take account of trade-offs and political realities. The sort of short-term, “what ideas do we have to keep from losing more House seats this year?” thinking exemplified by Gingrich’s to-do list is being driven by events and is entirely reactive. If you are interested in having your side drive the debate on major policy questions, you need to take the initiative and be willing to look beyond the next midterm or general election to imagine a compelling vision and agenda. Always looking to the next election, staying firmly inside “the arena” at all times, is the path to intellectual and political exhaustion.

]]> By: chrisgbr http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10940 chrisgbr Thu, 22 May 2008 19:54:03 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10940 I think he's making the point (which Raymond Aron built a career on) that political opinions that do not engage with the trade-offs inherent in circumstances, are fit only for imaginary worlds, and dangerously ill-fitted for this imperfect one. I think he’s making the point (which Raymond Aron built a career on) that political opinions that do not engage with the trade-offs inherent in circumstances, are fit only for imaginary worlds, and dangerously ill-fitted for this imperfect one.

]]> By: Josiwe http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10939 Josiwe Thu, 22 May 2008 19:48:53 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10939 There's an idea in American politics that the only way to REALLY get anything done is to win the White House, a supermajority of Senators and Congressmen, and to put enough bodies in the SCOTUS to lock down the trifecta. Consistent with the "talking == appeasement" rhetoric is the idea that acting strongly from a position of weakness is useless and damaging. John Adams became embassador to Britain shortly after the war of Independence, where Americans were viewed (rightly!) as traitors. According to today's GOP, this was the height of folly. When rhetoric becomes ideology, well, 2000-2008. QED. There’s an idea in American politics that the only way to REALLY get anything done is to win the White House, a supermajority of Senators and Congressmen, and to put enough bodies in the SCOTUS to lock down the trifecta.

Consistent with the “talking == appeasement” rhetoric is the idea that acting strongly from a position of weakness is useless and damaging. John Adams became embassador to Britain shortly after the war of Independence, where Americans were viewed (rightly!) as traitors. According to today’s GOP, this was the height of folly.

When rhetoric becomes ideology, well, 2000-2008. QED.

]]> By: Adam01 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/comment-page-1/#comment-10937 Adam01 Thu, 22 May 2008 19:12:15 +0000 http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2008/05/22/anachoresis/#comment-10937 Stuttaford's inability to conceive of a truly human life not nailed to the mast of GOP politics reminded me of this: http://www.bellarmine.edu/studentaffairs/Graduation/berry_address.asp Stuttaford’s inability to conceive of a truly human life not nailed to the mast of GOP politics reminded me of this:

http://www.bellarmine.edu/studentaffairs/Graduation/berry_address.asp

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