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	<title>Comments on: Tailor-Made</title>
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	<description>n. the principle of good order&#60;br /&#62;&#60;br /&#62; "Observe the strange inversion of all order and sense! Dignity debased; how vilely is the function of a consul prostituted!" ~The Craftsman</description>
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		<title>By: Daniel Larison</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30450</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Larison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Mar 2009 04:05:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30450</guid>
		<description>The point of the original post is that the *GOP* cannot win over two different groups of voters when its agenda appeals to neither their values nor their interests.  Democrats win majorities among both these groups because those voters see the Democrats as representing them and their interests.  I would have thought it would be clear that Democrats have always enjoyed strong support from Jewish voters, and has gained strong support from Muslims in the wake of post-9/11 Bush-era policies.  It was not necessarily a given that Muslim voters back the Dems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The point of the original post is that the *GOP* cannot win over two different groups of voters when its agenda appeals to neither their values nor their interests.  Democrats win majorities among both these groups because those voters see the Democrats as representing them and their interests.  I would have thought it would be clear that Democrats have always enjoyed strong support from Jewish voters, and has gained strong support from Muslims in the wake of post-9/11 Bush-era policies.  It was not necessarily a given that Muslim voters back the Dems.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean S.</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30449</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean S.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Mar 2009 03:21:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30449</guid>
		<description>&quot;Politically, East Asians have several excellent qualities.&quot;

I haven&#039;t seen a potentially more tone deaf statement ever written, and it smacks of the kind of &quot;target audience&quot; nonsense that marketing (and in this case, political consultants) use to cash big checks while their clients make an ass of themselves. Stating that X is already an ideal conservative voter, but just doesn&#039;t know it, is simply an excuse to get on the &quot;the message, not the meaning, is the problem&quot; bandwagon. After all, if everyone is a secret conservative and doesn&#039;t know it, we don&#039;t really have to change anything do we?

&quot;It is a fact that the GOP represents the interests of East Asians better than the Democratic Party.&quot;

Clearly it isn&#039;t, and trying to lead off a conversation with an individual, let alone a segment of the population, by pointing out their idiots isn&#039;t fruitful. It&#039;s why Democratic rhetoric that talks about &quot;people voting against their own interest&quot; falls flat so often, and one reason why, semantically, Obama tried to pivot away from it (with the exception of the clinging to bibles and guns statement that fell like a ton of bricks).

What we do know, as a FACT, is that Democrats do represent East Asians better. After all, they do seem to continue voting for them. Is it possible that they&#039;re all secretly yearning to get that subliminal message from the RNC, and turn on into Republicans? Maybe. But I&#039;m guessing most of them are fairly rational, and are voting for their interests, even if their &quot;interests&quot; aren&#039;t what people have assigned them.

And to contradict what the original blog author stated, oddly enough Democrats have started winning both the Jewish vote AND the Muslim vote. Certainly some of the accusations of pandering ring true in the case of Democrats, but with a majority of Jewish politicians on the federal level being Democrats, and the only two federal level Muslims being Democrats, something must be working for them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Politically, East Asians have several excellent qualities.&#8221;</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t seen a potentially more tone deaf statement ever written, and it smacks of the kind of &#8220;target audience&#8221; nonsense that marketing (and in this case, political consultants) use to cash big checks while their clients make an ass of themselves. Stating that X is already an ideal conservative voter, but just doesn&#8217;t know it, is simply an excuse to get on the &#8220;the message, not the meaning, is the problem&#8221; bandwagon. After all, if everyone is a secret conservative and doesn&#8217;t know it, we don&#8217;t really have to change anything do we?</p>
<p>&#8220;It is a fact that the GOP represents the interests of East Asians better than the Democratic Party.&#8221;</p>
<p>Clearly it isn&#8217;t, and trying to lead off a conversation with an individual, let alone a segment of the population, by pointing out their idiots isn&#8217;t fruitful. It&#8217;s why Democratic rhetoric that talks about &#8220;people voting against their own interest&#8221; falls flat so often, and one reason why, semantically, Obama tried to pivot away from it (with the exception of the clinging to bibles and guns statement that fell like a ton of bricks).</p>
<p>What we do know, as a FACT, is that Democrats do represent East Asians better. After all, they do seem to continue voting for them. Is it possible that they&#8217;re all secretly yearning to get that subliminal message from the RNC, and turn on into Republicans? Maybe. But I&#8217;m guessing most of them are fairly rational, and are voting for their interests, even if their &#8220;interests&#8221; aren&#8217;t what people have assigned them.</p>
<p>And to contradict what the original blog author stated, oddly enough Democrats have started winning both the Jewish vote AND the Muslim vote. Certainly some of the accusations of pandering ring true in the case of Democrats, but with a majority of Jewish politicians on the federal level being Democrats, and the only two federal level Muslims being Democrats, something must be working for them.</p>
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		<title>By: Gordianus</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30335</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordianus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 22:34:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30335</guid>
		<description>BarryD, in many years of GOP political activity, it&#039;s odd that no one every actually said that to me.  Not even in the most private discussion did anyone ever say &quot;ours is the party of white people.&quot;  Maybe I just wasn&#039;t in the room when all the bigots spoke up.  

But seriously, I&#039;ve heard plenty of people say that the Democratic Party was the party of, or for, Blacks, Hispanics, Gays, etc.  The GOP became the party of Whites by default.  Now some, like the folks over at Vdare say that the GOP should become the party of the Whites in fact.  The GOP has had outreach to non-whites for years.  Perhaps it&#039;s hopeless, but it&#039;s not for want of trying.  It is a fact that the GOP represents the interests of East Asians better than the Democratic Party.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BarryD, in many years of GOP political activity, it&#8217;s odd that no one every actually said that to me.  Not even in the most private discussion did anyone ever say &#8220;ours is the party of white people.&#8221;  Maybe I just wasn&#8217;t in the room when all the bigots spoke up.  </p>
<p>But seriously, I&#8217;ve heard plenty of people say that the Democratic Party was the party of, or for, Blacks, Hispanics, Gays, etc.  The GOP became the party of Whites by default.  Now some, like the folks over at Vdare say that the GOP should become the party of the Whites in fact.  The GOP has had outreach to non-whites for years.  Perhaps it&#8217;s hopeless, but it&#8217;s not for want of trying.  It is a fact that the GOP represents the interests of East Asians better than the Democratic Party.</p>
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		<title>By: BarryD</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30323</link>
		<dc:creator>BarryD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 14:25:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30323</guid>
		<description>Gordianus:  &quot;But on the topic of groups who actually should be voting with the right but donâ€™t, what about East Asians? Itâ€™s always amazed me that Chinese and Japanese Americans tend to vote for the Democrats. &quot;

There&#039;s this thing, it&#039;s called &#039;non-white&#039;.  The GOP has worked very, very hard to be the Party of White Men; this has had some obvious effects.  Notice that the GOP is well along in the process of p*ssing off Hispanics, which was the one &#039;non-white&#039; group it had a chance to break parity in.

IMHO, this is due to a multi-decade strategy of concentrating on a base which was more and more narrow, in a country which was slowly growing more and more diverse.

&quot;Itâ€™s particularly odd that the Japanese vote for the party of Roosevelt, who interned them. &quot;

That would be because the Democratic party is the party of civil rights, while the GOP is the party of laughing at Gitmo, enthusiasm about torture, and sh*tting on the Bill of Rights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gordianus:  &#8220;But on the topic of groups who actually should be voting with the right but donâ€™t, what about East Asians? Itâ€™s always amazed me that Chinese and Japanese Americans tend to vote for the Democrats. &#8221;</p>
<p>There&#8217;s this thing, it&#8217;s called &#8216;non-white&#8217;.  The GOP has worked very, very hard to be the Party of White Men; this has had some obvious effects.  Notice that the GOP is well along in the process of p*ssing off Hispanics, which was the one &#8216;non-white&#8217; group it had a chance to break parity in.</p>
<p>IMHO, this is due to a multi-decade strategy of concentrating on a base which was more and more narrow, in a country which was slowly growing more and more diverse.</p>
<p>&#8220;Itâ€™s particularly odd that the Japanese vote for the party of Roosevelt, who interned them. &#8221;</p>
<p>That would be because the Democratic party is the party of civil rights, while the GOP is the party of laughing at Gitmo, enthusiasm about torture, and sh*tting on the Bill of Rights.</p>
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		<title>By: ottovbvs</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30322</link>
		<dc:creator>ottovbvs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 14:02:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30322</guid>
		<description>THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM
Daniel: you are just about the best most clear eyed conservative/Republican opinionater out there today. And now after that bit of boot licking it only remains for me to endorse your thoughts. All the &quot;Communication&quot; we see coming from conservatives today divides into two neat piles. On one side we have increasingly strident messages from Pence, Rove, Limbaugh, Cantor, Kristol et al constantly asserting the rightness of each and every policy position that we and the country have become very familiar with over the past eight years. Furthermore, any attempts to deal with the widely perceived consequences of these policies by Obama and the democrats must be resisted at every turn at whatever the cost to the American people. And btw why hasn&#039;t Obama brought universal world peace in three weeks as he promised. If all this wasn&#039;t stupid enough we then have Steele and assorted luminaries creating the other communication pile by essentially saying the problem is not the policies it&#039;s the way we&#039;re selling them. As Tom Davis famously pointed out it aint the labels that are the problem it&#039;s the dogfood that the dogs don&#039;t like. I don&#039;t know how long it&#039;s going to take for the GOP to tell the difference, maybe they never will. At best it&#039;s going to take a long time for the simple reason the party has been taken hostage by social/nationalist movement conservatives. They are married to a set of beliefs that is supported strongly by only about 30% of the electorate. In elections they can count on another 10-15% of the electorate who still votes Republican out of habit, tribalism or whatever. Even worse where their support is strong, it&#039;s concentrated both geographically and demographically. This is the elephant in the room. I see no leaders on the horizon who have the ability to break this model and remake conservatism with the possible exception of Jeb Bush and his name is lets face it toxic. For the rest they are and come off as either doctrinaire conservatives or time servers like Steele. The country is facing huge structural economic problems and need to manage its relative decline over the next 50 years but conservatism and the GOP isn&#039;t beginning to address them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM<br />
Daniel: you are just about the best most clear eyed conservative/Republican opinionater out there today. And now after that bit of boot licking it only remains for me to endorse your thoughts. All the &#8220;Communication&#8221; we see coming from conservatives today divides into two neat piles. On one side we have increasingly strident messages from Pence, Rove, Limbaugh, Cantor, Kristol et al constantly asserting the rightness of each and every policy position that we and the country have become very familiar with over the past eight years. Furthermore, any attempts to deal with the widely perceived consequences of these policies by Obama and the democrats must be resisted at every turn at whatever the cost to the American people. And btw why hasn&#8217;t Obama brought universal world peace in three weeks as he promised. If all this wasn&#8217;t stupid enough we then have Steele and assorted luminaries creating the other communication pile by essentially saying the problem is not the policies it&#8217;s the way we&#8217;re selling them. As Tom Davis famously pointed out it aint the labels that are the problem it&#8217;s the dogfood that the dogs don&#8217;t like. I don&#8217;t know how long it&#8217;s going to take for the GOP to tell the difference, maybe they never will. At best it&#8217;s going to take a long time for the simple reason the party has been taken hostage by social/nationalist movement conservatives. They are married to a set of beliefs that is supported strongly by only about 30% of the electorate. In elections they can count on another 10-15% of the electorate who still votes Republican out of habit, tribalism or whatever. Even worse where their support is strong, it&#8217;s concentrated both geographically and demographically. This is the elephant in the room. I see no leaders on the horizon who have the ability to break this model and remake conservatism with the possible exception of Jeb Bush and his name is lets face it toxic. For the rest they are and come off as either doctrinaire conservatives or time servers like Steele. The country is facing huge structural economic problems and need to manage its relative decline over the next 50 years but conservatism and the GOP isn&#8217;t beginning to address them.</p>
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		<title>By: Gordianus</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30300</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordianus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:42:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30300</guid>
		<description>Yes, the days when minority groups lived in their own ghettos and relied on community go-betweens for political information are long gone.  

But on the topic of groups who actually should be voting with the right but don&#039;t, what about East Asians?  It&#039;s always amazed me that Chinese and Japanese Americans tend to vote for the Democrats.  It&#039;s particularly odd that the Japanese vote for the party of Roosevelt, who interned them.  

Politically, East Asians have several excellent qualities.  They are generally affluent, educated and willing to engage in communal enterprise.  They have &quot;Confucian&quot; values of thrift, work, and orderliness.  Many (most?) are Christian and believe in what we now call family values.  While immigration and dual loyalty may be a stumbling block issues I don&#039;t think they are necessarily a deadly one.  The issue of hidden university admission  quotas is very much on their minds at the moment.  

Apart from mere political opportunism there is a real case to be made for an alliance between East Asians and Caucasian Americans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, the days when minority groups lived in their own ghettos and relied on community go-betweens for political information are long gone.  </p>
<p>But on the topic of groups who actually should be voting with the right but don&#8217;t, what about East Asians?  It&#8217;s always amazed me that Chinese and Japanese Americans tend to vote for the Democrats.  It&#8217;s particularly odd that the Japanese vote for the party of Roosevelt, who interned them.  </p>
<p>Politically, East Asians have several excellent qualities.  They are generally affluent, educated and willing to engage in communal enterprise.  They have &#8220;Confucian&#8221; values of thrift, work, and orderliness.  Many (most?) are Christian and believe in what we now call family values.  While immigration and dual loyalty may be a stumbling block issues I don&#8217;t think they are necessarily a deadly one.  The issue of hidden university admission  quotas is very much on their minds at the moment.  </p>
<p>Apart from mere political opportunism there is a real case to be made for an alliance between East Asians and Caucasian Americans.</p>
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		<title>By: Grumpy Old Man</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30295</link>
		<dc:creator>Grumpy Old Man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 04:42:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30295</guid>
		<description>No animals were injured in the making of this twelve-point program.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No animals were injured in the making of this twelve-point program.</p>
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		<title>By: RedPhillips</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30292</link>
		<dc:creator>RedPhillips</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 00:42:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30292</guid>
		<description>This is the John Hawkins of Right Wing News, right? What a joke. That guy was one of the biggest of the war mongering, the &quot;Islamofascists&quot; are out to kill us all unless we bomb them first, anti-Muslim hysterics. He specifically attacked Ron Paul for his non-interventionism. How on earth does he plan to tailor a message to Muslims? Join us so you can help us demonize and bomb your kin? Give me a break.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is the John Hawkins of Right Wing News, right? What a joke. That guy was one of the biggest of the war mongering, the &#8220;Islamofascists&#8221; are out to kill us all unless we bomb them first, anti-Muslim hysterics. He specifically attacked Ron Paul for his non-interventionism. How on earth does he plan to tailor a message to Muslims? Join us so you can help us demonize and bomb your kin? Give me a break.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Larison</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30289</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Larison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 23:38:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30289</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s true.  It might have been easier when communication was more difficult and news coverage was not as constant and extensive, but even in an era when newspapers and telegraphs ruled it would have been hard to put out two opposing messages to satisfy different constituencies.  I still don&#039;t understand how you could &quot;tailor&quot; a message in which the &quot;war on terror&quot; and everything associated with it is good and right--which is more or less the GOP message when it comes to such things--and make most Muslims (or most Jews, who I imagine oppose many of these policies as well) find it appealing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s true.  It might have been easier when communication was more difficult and news coverage was not as constant and extensive, but even in an era when newspapers and telegraphs ruled it would have been hard to put out two opposing messages to satisfy different constituencies.  I still don&#8217;t understand how you could &#8220;tailor&#8221; a message in which the &#8220;war on terror&#8221; and everything associated with it is good and right&#8211;which is more or less the GOP message when it comes to such things&#8211;and make most Muslims (or most Jews, who I imagine oppose many of these policies as well) find it appealing.</p>
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		<title>By: E.D. Kain</title>
		<link>http://www.amconmag.com/larison/2009/02/17/tailor-made/comment-page-1/#comment-30288</link>
		<dc:creator>E.D. Kain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 23:25:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amconmag.com/larison/?p=8452#comment-30288</guid>
		<description>Tailor-made politics simply will not (cannot!) work in an information age.  Too easy to call out the hypocrisies such methods would inevitably entail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tailor-made politics simply will not (cannot!) work in an information age.  Too easy to call out the hypocrisies such methods would inevitably entail.</p>
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